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IWI : TAINUI  

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Palmy_gurl OWC
(@palmy_gurl-owc)
Active Member

Hi, I am needing help with Greetings and Farewells for the Iwi Tainui

Formal Situation:
(Powhiri and Poroporoaki) I would like to know a Greeting and Farewell for this situation.

(Mihi/Karakia) I would like to know a Greeting and Farewell for this situation.

Informal situation:
(I-Mera) I would like to know a Greeting and Farewell for this situation.

(Waea) I would like to know a Greeting and Farewell for this situation.

Thanks

Quote
Posted : 05 December, 2007 8:16 am
matahuru OWC
(@matahuru-owc)
Eminent Member

Tena koe palmy girl

Women and men folk are involved in the powhiri process by performing the following chant:

LEADER: Ä, töia mai,
CHORUS: Te waka!
LEADER: Ki te urunga,
CHORUS: Te waka!
LEADER: Ki te moenga,
CHORUS: Te waka!
ALL: Ki te takoto runga i takoto ai te waka!

Translation:
Drag hither
The canoe!
To the entry
The canoe!
To the berth,
The canoe!
To the resting place to lie. The canoe!

Tauinui does not perform the wero so after the chant, manuhiri move to the left of the paepae and the kaikorero prepare to greet them.

The poroporoaki ceremony varies around the rohe but basically, an elder will open the poroporoaki with a karakia. This karakia will depend on the elder but the basic format involves a karakia to the Atua to whakarite the entire event. Then they may move to aknowledging the whanau pani (the immediate grieving family) and then the extended whanau that have come to farewell their loved one. Then the elder may speak directly to the tupaapaku (deceased) and send them home to 'te hono i wairua' the gathering place of spirits. Following that there is a waiata as usual after some speaks, then the prayer to close the doors of the spirit world is performed:

Apiti hono tatai hono etc

Following that the speaker will then open the floor to anyone else that may wish to speak.

I will leave the rest for others from tainui.

Cheers

Edited by - matahuru on Dec 05 2007 09:22:18 AM

ReplyQuote
Posted : 05 December, 2007 9:17 am
tane_ariki OWC
(@tane_ariki-owc)
Trusted Member

My two question are what do you need the answers for and are you unable to get to Otaki to ask kaumatua there?

ReplyQuote
Posted : 05 December, 2007 12:00 pm
Palmy_gurl OWC
(@palmy_gurl-owc)
Active Member

Thanks, I am currently learning about different Iwi's so would like to know. I am doing a trip to a Marae soon, so need to get a fair idea of what each Iwi is like.

ReplyQuote
Posted : 06 December, 2007 7:09 pm
tane_ariki OWC
(@tane_ariki-owc)
Trusted Member

Thankyou for that Bridget.

One final request, what are your iwi affiliations? Are you able to present them in whakapapa/pepeha format? If so, can you please present them.

ReplyQuote
Posted : 06 December, 2007 7:29 pm
hinemako OWC
(@hinemako-owc)
Active Member

Qoute: Tauinui does not perform the wero :Unqoute

Tainui do perform the wero we just don't do so at every powhiri or on request, our wero is reserved because of the mana behind it, its hard to be taught so much so that there is not many if any who know our Waikato maurakau and wero outside of Waikato it is protected by Ngati Mahanga Toa and Maunga Pirongia.....Its the same teachings of those given to Kingi Potaatau and Kingi Tawhiao so you can see why it is not openly shown....because Waikato mau rakau and the wero is hardly shown or given so it has created somewhat of a reputation because of its own history.....but needless to say Waikato is Waikato we do things our way......

Edited by - hinemako on Dec 09 2007 09:09:13 AM

Edited by - hinemako on Dec 09 2007 09:11:37 AM

ReplyQuote
Posted : 09 December, 2007 8:21 am
Palmy_gurl OWC
(@palmy_gurl-owc)
Active Member

Are you able to give me a simple example of each of the following? One Greeting and one Farewell in each of the following situations?

Formal Situation:
(Powhiri and Poroporoaki) I would like to know a Greeting and Farewell for this situation.

(Mihi/Karakia) I would like to know a Greeting and Farewell for this situation.

Informal situation:
(I-Mera) I would like to know a Greeting and Farewell for this situation.

(Waea) I would like to know a Greeting and Farewell for this situation.

ReplyQuote
Posted : 09 December, 2007 2:44 pm
tane_ariki OWC
(@tane_ariki-owc)
Trusted Member

quote:


Are you able to give me a simple example of each of the following? One Greeting and one Farewell in each of the following situations?

Formal Situation:
(Powhiri and Poroporoaki) I would like to know a Greeting and Farewell for this situation.

(Mihi/Karakia) I would like to know a Greeting and Farewell for this situation.

Informal situation:
(I-Mera) I would like to know a Greeting and Farewell for this situation.

(Waea) I would like to know a Greeting and Farewell for this situation.

Bridget


It would help knowing your tribal affiliations firstly because these are things you pick up by just heading off down to the marae and listening to people speak. Your own tribal formalities are more important than other people's affiliations.

quote:


LEADER: Ä, töia mai,
CHORUS: Te waka!
LEADER: Ki te urunga,
CHORUS: Te waka!
LEADER: Ki te moenga,
CHORUS: Te waka!
ALL: Ki te takoto runga i takoto ai te waka!


Oooo he pape kei roto i tena!

Me penei ke te takikupu "ki te takotoranga" (he nenekara tenei "ki te takoto runga"

I te whakatepenga o nga whai korero, kua rangona e au tenei whakatauaki - E kore te wapu e haere ki te tima. Ko tona aronga - me haere atu nga manuwhiri ki te hariru me te hongi ki te tangata whenua i te tara iti (wapu = tauranga waka, tima = waka).

Kaore te nuinga o nga manuwhiri e marama ana ki taua whakatauaki, no te mea, kotahi anake te koroua e whakamahi ana i taua mea, a, he hakirikiri (cryptic) tonu ano te aronga.

Edited by - tane_ariki on Dec 09 2007 11:38:34 PM

ReplyQuote
Posted : 09 December, 2007 11:33 pm
matahuru OWC
(@matahuru-owc)
Eminent Member

quote:


quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
LEADER: Ä, töia mai,
CHORUS: Te waka!
LEADER: Ki te urunga,
CHORUS: Te waka!
LEADER: Ki te moenga,
CHORUS: Te waka!
ALL: Ki te takoto runga i takoto ai te waka!
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Oooo he pape kei roto i tena!

Me penei ke te takikupu "ki te takotoranga" (he nenekara tenei "ki te takoto runga"


haha Ooo tika e tane. E whakatauira au taua korero no tetahi ipurangi. Engari kaore au e atatitiro nga kupu katoa kei roto. Arohamai palmygirl.

Kia ora hinemako

Which enforces my point that we do not perform the wero. I have never seen it in a formal or informal event within waikato. The only time I have seen it is at the coronation during Te Ata's time, when the Te Arawa delegation perform for her and acted as her personal escort.

Yes we do have a mau rakau tradition that sadly dwindles today for what ever reason. Turangawaewae ran an internal wananga a few years ago for those that were keen to learn. I have also spoken with elders that learned in the last wananga's taught in waikato over 40 years ago that stated it was an extremly deadly and formidable stlye of stick fighting, reserved for the hereditary teachers of the art and their descendents.

There was one other incident where a good friend of mine, and a relative of Te Ata, was asked to perform a wero on her 40th Anniversary as queen. Outside of this I have never seen it done in the waikato as opposed to somewhere like Ngati Kahungunu where it is performed at almost all powhiri, formal ones especially.

Kia ora koutou.

Edited by - matahuru on Dec 10 2007 07:52:11 AM

ReplyQuote
Posted : 10 December, 2007 7:49 am
Palmy_gurl OWC
(@palmy_gurl-owc)
Active Member

I am not Maori, so have no tribal affiliations

ReplyQuote
Posted : 10 December, 2007 11:07 am
tane_ariki OWC
(@tane_ariki-owc)
Trusted Member

Kia ora tatou

quote:


haha Ooo tika e tane. E whakatauira au taua korero no tetahi ipurangi. Engari kaore au e atatitiro nga kupu katoa kei roto.



E pai ana!

quote:


Which enforces my point that we do not perform the wero. I have never seen it in a formal or informal event within waikato. The only time I have seen it is at the coronation during Te Ata's time, when the Te Arawa delegation perform for her and acted as her personal escort.


Then does anyone know how to do it and are they teaching it. I remember, at one of the marae I affiliate to, I won't mention the name to save them embarrassment, but they decided they didn't have to do a karanga to welcome manuwhiri on. The reason they didn't have the karanga of course was because no one could karanga. And people who know how to whai korero in any style has nearly dried up. Now any joe bloggs can get up on the paepae and whai korero because they know the reo not because they know how to whai korero. Which is really bad because there are a lot of kaumatua and pakeke who should be seated on the paepae first but can't because they can't say anything more than tena koutou, nau mai haere mai.

quote:


Yes we do have a mau rakau tradition that sadly dwindles today for what ever reason. Turangawaewae ran an internal wananga a few years ago for those that were keen to learn. I have also spoken with elders that learned in the last wananga's taught in waikato over 40 years ago that stated it was an extremly deadly and formidable stlye of stick fighting, reserved for the hereditary teachers of the art and their descendents.


Thats just like how weaving died in my whanau but is experiencing a revival. None of the aunts can weave but some of their daughters can because they were inspired by nan who would sit down and start weaving a basket while chatting excitedly to the other weavers and getting great joy at making the others stop because they couldn't concentrate on weaving, talking and listening at the same time. Thats the standard the weavers in my family want to reach, the one that nan set. Nan also used to turn up at random kuia's places with a whole bundle of flax and tell them that they have to start weaving something with her.

quote:


There was one other incident where a good friend of mine, and a relative of Te Ata, was asked to perform a wero on her 40th Anniversary as queen. Outside of this I have never seen it done in the waikato as opposed to somewhere like Ngati Kahungunu where it is performed at almost all powhiri, formal ones especially.


Do you think then it has come to the time for mau rakau Waikato style to be taught more generally amongst Tainui peoples so we can do wero on demand. At the same marae that I affiliate to where the people think its ok to not have a karanga for tangihanga they can't do poukai because apparently the facilities are too small. Much work is needed to be done.

ReplyQuote
Posted : 10 December, 2007 11:33 am
matahuru OWC
(@matahuru-owc)
Eminent Member

Brilliant idea. I would love to learn mau rakau waikato styles and I suppose I could start with the elder I mentioned earlier. He still lives in the general area.

I will ask around our oldies and find out firstly, why we do not perform the wero as many other iwi do, and secondly, would it be possible to organise some wananga. Maybe even include karanga, whai korero and raranga? Hmmm brilliant idea. I know that wananga for those latter subjects are presently being taught in our area but they are few and far between.

Maybe we could look at wananga at the tainui games to include all marae from within the iwi including Hauraki and maniapoto?

Anyway will research and get back to you..

Cheers.

ReplyQuote
Posted : 10 December, 2007 12:27 pm
tane_ariki OWC
(@tane_ariki-owc)
Trusted Member

yes that would be an excellent idea.

The last "wananga" I went to it was about the kingitanga. I was hoping to go learn something new but instead it was just a rehash of all the general knowledge (though they had a whakatauaki of Te Puea so it was worth it just for that).

It concerns me that Whaea Mamae Takerei noted that Waikato were quite ignorant to the history of the kingitanga compared to other iwi from around the island. She said this to an audience that consisted not only of Tainui but also people from Mataatua as well. And the reason it concerns me is that it is that bad that Whaea Mamae had to say something about it. But she said it to challenge Tainui to get on board with the kaupapa and learn about te kingitanga me tona tahuhu korero.

I believe the Tainui trustboard provides funding for wananga but that funding can only be accessed by the raupatu marae. That means Hauraki, Maniapoto, Tamaki Makaurau and other Tainui groups to the south (e.g. Ngati Raukawa ki te tonga) can't access that funding (though that funding can be channelled through Te Puea in Tamaki Makaurau).

I mean, this has to be a waka initiative as you've already indicated Hauraki and Maniapoto need to participate as well for it to be meaningful. But there are still too many Tainui who may not be able to access such a style of learning just purely because their iwi or hapu are not affiliated to the Tainui trustboard.

Are we able to set up an organization or a confederation of trustboards under one umbrella where by waka wide initiatives can be set up?

ReplyQuote
Posted : 10 December, 2007 7:34 pm
Rakaimataura OWC
(@rakaimataura-owc)
New Member

Just to raise a point about the wero & mau rakau traditions of Waikato:

At the Koroneihana just passed there were several wero and rakau performances throughout the whole celebration. Also at Te Arikinui's tangi, there was were performed.

I personally know several of the men who performed these tasks; many of them descendants of the kahui ariki and have been trained by tohunga mau rakau of the whare tu taua of Ngati Mahanga & Ngati Mahuta.

Turangawaewae however is perhaps the only marae in Waikato were wero is still maintained (ki taku nei titiro) however at a tangihanga at Waahi Pa the tupapaku was led out by a group of young men with taiaha.

He kai noaiho teneki ma koutou o Tainui

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Posted : 10 December, 2007 9:49 pm
tane_ariki OWC
(@tane_ariki-owc)
Trusted Member

Tena koe e te hoa,

Ae, ka mahara ake i a au tena. Kua matakitaki atu au ki te wero e meinga ana e nga taitamariki i te tangihanga o Te Ariki Nui, ka rangona e au te wanawana e puta ake ana i a ratou katoa no ratou e tu ana.

Oh and aroha mai kaore ano au kia whakahoki atu ki tau panui i runga i a pipau, kua wareware katoa i a au ki te whakahoki atu akuanei ka tae atu ki tau pipau ngaku kupu. MO taku he kua waiho koe kia whanga ana...!

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Posted : 10 December, 2007 11:18 pm
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